BBC Mundo has an powerful article covering the forced recruitment of child soldiers by the FARC and other illegal armed groups in Colombia. The groups' stealing of children is forcing families to flee their homes, adding to the already high number of displaced inside of Colombia.
Also, as the article notes, NGO's in Colombia report that the average age of child soldiers in Colombia has dropped from 13 to somewhere between 11 and 12. The article contains quotes from people who say there are FARC units with children as young as eight fighting.
19 comments:
Perhaps those young FARC recruits will mix in nicely with the Venezuelan paramilitary units.
I wrote here awhile ago that the guerillas who kidnapped my wife's uncle also tried to take his young son away.
But I'm we'll be treated to Leftside's informed opinion that this is just more "propaganda that's so prevalent" in regards to the FARC.
Oh well yes, it is all so clear now. Widespread "stealing of children" by FARC is evident because some parents appear to claim it almost happened to them. Nevermind one's more than a little fishy story whereby a mother (with some relation to the local FARC Commander) knew something was going to happen that day and that she was able to just walk right up to the Commander and take her son back off a boat. Nevermind the other woman seems to admit that her children, 17 and 15, left on their own. A victims rights group in Bogota that sustains itself by making outrageous claims (average age is 11.5 - come on) puts a reporter in touch with these families and this is what we get. Forget the possibility that a parent is too proud to admit their child felt a need to go out and make a living with the FARC to help support their family. That's impossible, right? Their words do not even seem to support the claims made by the reporter.
As I have said before, I would not be surprised that many terrible things are indeed happening as result of the armed situation in the reaches of Colombia. But I am going to need something more than this to believe FARC has a policy to steal children against their own stated policies (and against the findings of UNHCR). FARC is anything but a group without rules. A morally challenged group, but one with rules nonetheless.
"But I am going to need something more than this to believe FARC has a policy to steal children against their own stated policies..."
Kidnap them? Sure. Kill them? No problemo. Massacre whole villages? absolutely. Pilfer youngsters to fill their rapidly depleting ranks? Now you've gone too far, says wunderkind Leftside.
"A morally challenged group, but one with rules nonetheless."
Another one of those "imperfect" entities Leftside supports out of some idiotic "social justice" solidarity.
Was he always like this, or has Leftside become more of a FARC fanboy of late?
Like alot of Leftists, he claims he doesn't actually support them, but can always be counted on to defend them and demonize Uribe.
Please forgive me for trying to get down to the truth of a matter, even when it involves a group everyone despises. That should not be permission to lie and exaggerate. When a correction is needed or there are questions or contradictions arise, I am accused of defending FARC. This is the modus operundi of the right. They lie and unfairly attack things like Russia, Cuba, or "terrorists" and when someone comes along and questions the lies, they are accused of defending terrorists. It is a BS logic to anyone with a more than middle school education.
Forgive me if I take the recent word (2008) of an impartial UN agency who's job is to be on the ground protecting children (UNICEF) more than ungrounded assertions found in a news report. I guarantee this reporter was told to go get a story of forcible child recruitment - by the FARC not the right-wing groups, which have no rules against child recruitment, mind you. Maybe there have been too many Uribe corruption stories in the BBC lately and "balance" is needed. This reporter tried his best but the reporting does not match the assertions. I guarantee he made no attempt to verify the story, to ask the mothers any difficult questions that might contradict the intended headline of the piece. This type of "journalism" is too typical on issues like this where they know no one is going to stand up and question. All the more reason for a counter argument. If you want to argue my points go ahead, but save the smear campaign.
There is nothing to forgive Leftside, you are not harming anyone, just making a fool of yourself.
Once again, this isn't a UN document. It's from the Immigration refugee board of Canada. The UN simply provides the document for reference; it does not endorse its conclusions.
Forced recruitment of child soldiers by the FARC has been documented by numerous NGO's and media.
Regarding the quotes from a UNICEF representative, those were quotes in the media and not official UN statements. Most media and NGO's disagree.
But as long as you're believing UNICEF, perhaps you should also pay attention to the quote a few sentences later:
A UNICEF representative in Colombia told Radio Caracol that the FARC seduces young girls and that "as soon as the girls are recruited for the groups they are used sexually and forced to have abortions if they become pregnant"
We've already hashed this issue to death a month or two ago, when Boz felt the need to dedicate a similar posting to another ill-researched article on this issue. I'm sure he saw this article as a way to butress that even more poorly written piece. I am not impressed. What I am looking for are facts. I found some.
According to a 2002 UNICEF study, 83% of child soldiers volunteered out of limited economic or educational prospects - or a sense of camaradarie. A 1998 Colombian Army survey said that 14% were what they would describe as forced recruits. Both surveys were done by interviewing decommissioned soldiers. Again, not the most scientific apprioach, as there is an obvious incentive to make it seem like one was forced into the FARC.
As for the presence of underage soldiers, FARC spokesman has said there are sometimes "exceptions" to their rule that prohibits sub-15 year olds rule from serving:
There are areas where children beg insistently to join the guerrillas, but there are also situations in which their very own mothers, who are desperate, take their children to the guerrillas because their families live in misery... It’s very difficult to tell them no.
Meanwhile, the more I look into the issue, the more I see that the Colombian Government has a long way to go to set the bar higher. More than 15,000 child soldiers were serving in the Colombian armed forces in 1998. Recruiting of soldiers under the age of 18 still occurs, despite recent laws to try to stop it. The military puts pressure on ex-child guerilla soldiers to serve as "guides" and work for the military. They put child offenders in military barracks (Law 81) rather than juvenile prisons, which often results in them being coerced into joining the military. There are widespread reports of using children as informers. There are forced recruitment of conscientious objectors. Meanwhile, only 69% of Colombian students that start primary school reach grade 5!!! Again, the root of all the problems is the inability of the Colombian State to provide meaningul opportunities to its rural and slum dwelling population.
I believe the dozens of NGO's and hundreds of witnesses who say the FARC forcibly recruit children as young as eight. I believe the demobilized FARC women who say they were raped and abused by FARC commanders. I don't believe the FARC "rules" are an honest representation of how they act. The fact you are willing to believe the FARC's mythical rules and not those who have suffered at their hands is absurd.
Maybe this makes me a bad person, but fuck me if watching leftside try to defend the indefensible isn't entertaining.
I believe the dozens of NGO's and hundreds of witnesses who say the FARC forcibly recruit children as young as eight.
Good for you, that takes real courage of you to go out on a limb like that. If you can show me one verified instance of FARC forcibly recuiting an 8 year old it might actually have some meaning. Even more so if a pattern could be established. Believe me, I do not enjoy having to argue this point. But you seem intent on lowering the bar for truth on this issue, which is aburd, since everyone agrees the FARC is guilty of much more heinous violations. But to focus on this nearly negligable cause of displacement, when I can not find that you've ever posted on the paramilitary's or government's much higher responsibilty on this terrible issue, is what lends you no moral authority.
I believe the demobilized FARC women who say they were raped and abused by FARC commanders.
Do you think the FARC has some sort of policy to rape women? Do you think any instance was anything more than a bad apple? Do you concern yourself with the instances of rape by members of Colombian security forces - and Americans in country for Plan Colombia? Are you concerned that Colombia has a terrible record on prosecuting rapists? And those who are proeecuted are normally give parole. Where are the posts about all that? Your concern is phony and one-sided, based on your written record here (as far as I can tell).
I don't believe the FARC "rules" are an honest representation of how they act. The fact you are willing to believe the FARC's mythical rules and not those who have suffered at their hands is absurd.
It is not a matter of one or the other. I can analyze a news story and question whether the whole story was presented fairly. I can also understand that rules are broken. But this idea that FARC goes around kidnapping 8 year olds to serve in their army is just ridiculous - and a rather cheap way to try to score political points. It would be easy to ignore it and let the accusations fly. But I was hoping to dig deeper into the issue to get to the heart of it. You seem to have no such interest - and continue to only cheapen the argument with outrageous accusations about 8 year olds and rapes, pretending like they are some policy or pattern of action. Until you can prove that, your arguments here are baseless.
From the HRW 2003 report about child soldiers in Colombia:
The vast majority of former child combatants interviewed by Human Rights Watch were recruited before reaching the stated minimum age of fifteen. Of the seventy-two former members of the FARC-EP who specified the age at which they joined the group, fifty-seven said that they had joined between the ages of seven and fourteen.... According to our interviews, the typical age at recruitment was between eleven and thirteen.
As other NGO's have more recently reported, that average age of recruitment has decreased since that report was written. Nobody should be in denial about this serious issue.
Actually, UNICEF reports children as young as 7 were recruited by the guerrillas.
From http://www.unicef.org/colombia/pdf/boletin-8.pdf:
A pesar de que reclutar menores de 18 años se encuentra prohibido en la legislación
colombiana y que la normativa internacional humanitaria establece esta prohibición para
los menores de 15 años, es alarmante que el 61% de los adolescentes entrevistados hayan
ingresado al grupo armado entre los 7 y los 14 años.
Oh, and about the 83% percent who supposedly 'volunteered':
Como ya se anotó en la investigación, se pudo comprobar que el 83% de los adolescentes
entrevistados en el centro de atención especializada para niños desvinculados del
conflicto armado, manifiesta que ingresó de manera “voluntaria” a los grupos armados.
Sin embargo, se debe tratar con mucho cuidado la situación de vinculación voluntaria de
los niños y niñas con las organizaciones armadas al margen de la ley, ya que existen
diversos factores de índole económico, social, y familiar que inciden en esta decisión,
razón por la cual, la voluntariedad de dicha vinculación es relativa. Un ejemplo de esto es
que la relación existente entre dichas organizaciones armadas y la comunidad se funda en
el ejercicio del poder a través de la violencia; esto implica que la población civil tenga
como única opción para resistir estos ataques, la muerte o la vinculación.
The point of my words from the start was the notion that FARC has some sort of policy or condones the "stealing of children." We are still nowhere on that. It is like arguing right-wing militias in Bolivia have a policy of extermination of idios based on a couple incidents... well actually, there is much documentation of words to that effect and an element of command and control in those cases. But you get what I mean hopefully.
The information provided above adds nothing new to the issue I am contending. They paint a distressing picture, no doubt. But if you read the entire reports they always make clear the problem is spread around all the armed groups and that the Colombian Government has much to do to try to end the child recruitment practices. Certainly, stopping from using children as informers and indoctriniating them in army barracks would be a good start to establish some moral authority. Too bad folks here do not appear to share the broader concerns of the NGOs, and continue to focus on one armed group in this conflict. That one-sided approach is nothing new though here...
The point of my words from the start was the notion that FARC has some sort of policy or condones the "stealing of children."
Translation:
"If it's not actually on paper, there's no way you can prove it to me."
FARC and ELN are by far the worst offenders when it comes to child soldiers, so your usual equivalency argument as diversionary tactic doesn't quite work out.
http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2005/02/22/colomb10202.htm
Approximately 80 percent of child combatants in Colombia belong to one of the two left-wing guerrilla groups, the FARC or ELN. The remainder fights in paramilitary ranks.
But hey, keep telling us that there is "no policy" to recruit children.
"That one-sided approach is nothing new though here..."
That's because there aren't two equivalent sides in this conflict, asswipe. But keep pretending to not support the FARC(though you outwardly support all their allies)while coming to their defense at every opportunity.
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